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I thought of a new game.
05/23/2015, 10:09:40

    Xanax writes:

    At least I think it's new. Maybe somebody has thought of this before. Anyway, as mentioned I'd considered trying the one month game but quickly found out that I don't have the patience for repetitive reloading. So what I'm think is this:

    As far as I can see you only need to kill the following creatures to finish the game:

    Devil of Baa in the Devil's outpost.
    Two priests in the Superior Temple (keys).
    Sentinel of Varn in Tomb of Varn (key).
    The Queen in the hive (plus the reactor of course).

    Is there anything else anyone can think of?

    So I was thinking 4 sorcerers, lots and lots of Lloyd's Beacons and jumping around and try to finish the game without killing anything else. There are some other quests that can't be done, but they're not necessary. What do you think?





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You'll probably get stuck in some tight passageways & have to hack your way through, but interesting
05/23/2015, 18:11:38

    Ossie writes:





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I'll try this again.
05/23/2015, 21:48:55

    Xanax writes:

    My thought on that is to run towards the monsters, get as close as I can and then set a beacon. Then run away getting them to follow me as far as I can, then port back to that beacon which will hopefully be past them by then. Rinse and repeat. It may be tough in some places but I think it's doable with enough effort.




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So far, so good.
05/24/2015, 14:07:27

    Xanax writes:

    I killed the Devil of Baa in the outpost. Used Mass Distortion and then finished him off with my (skill 1) daggers. I'm thinking that that and Incinerate will be my go to spells for killing when I need to.

    Corlagon's was probably the trickiest place so far. Sometimes I had to back up a Beacon or two to get out of a tight spot. Worked it out though and didn't have any other problems. Silver Helm in Myst was also kind of tight in places. Found out that that secret door with the switch by the Master Monk will close if you Lloyd's Beacon in there, so had to maneuver the mobs so I could run from the switch to the door.

    Icewind Keep was easier than I expected. Set a beacon at each door switch but really just kept moving forward one beacon at a time till I go into the treasure room. Set a beacon there and then beaconed back out and sealed the secret door again.

    Gharik's Forge up next. That should be pretty easy - I've done that by mostly running through in the past. Varn looms in the future as the big challenge.

    My party doesn't even have bows. Will probably get Light for one person and Dark for another just for the protective and enhancement spells.





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As predicted, I'm stuck. Looking for suggestions.
05/24/2015, 19:00:16

    Xanax writes:

    Temple of Varn, Water Temple. The Defenders and Sentinels and such in the little stairway leading down to the chest cannot get out of there - they get stuck on each other. I've tried and retried probably 40 times and can't get them to come up. They just do that little fast back and forth thingie and stay there.

    I've set a beacon right next to them but them really don't move at all around that first corner.

    As I said, open to suggestions.

    Everything else has been very easy so far for the most part.





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I can't see a way out of that
05/25/2015, 05:40:33

    Ossie writes:

    Even if you stand right next to them to prompt a move, they tend to get stuck until you thin out a few. I'd be more inclined to reload that dungeon entirely (or at least a section before any of the creatures in that area move) & try to save when they don't get stuck in the first place




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I can think of one possibility, albeit a remote one
05/25/2015, 09:28:17

    Peter2 writes:

    If any of your party has access to either Town Portal or Lloyd's Beacon at any level, and you can find an area sufficiently far from your opponents that the spell doesn't fizzle, it will dump you somewhere outside – possibly in New Sorpigal. It's a pretty small chance; the game takes a large area into account when it checks whether you can cast these spells or rest, but it's the only one I can think of.




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Peter, my party has 4 masters in water magic.
05/25/2015, 12:36:14

    Xanax writes:

    Me getting out of there is not the problem. The problem is trying to get past them to get to the chest without killing them.

    I SHOULD have saved a game before I ever opened that door, but I only use one saved game per party and I'm past that now. I'm not sure it would have made a difference but it might have. I've tried setting a beacon as close to them as I can get, in hopes of inching it forward gradually, but no success. I've lured one all the way to the top of that little ramp all by himself and he will still not cross that line. He does the rapid back and forth thing no matter where I move, even though there are no other creatures around him, which tells me that none of them are ever coming off that ramp.

    I've also tried getting a couple of them down to low health in hopes that they will flee back down, but no luck with that either. For the most part they just stick in that one corner.

    I'll keep trying but I may end up having to kill them. Don't know what else to do.





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Some more ideas
05/25/2015, 17:05:33

    Peter2 writes:

    It won't help with your present party, but if you can see the chest, a couple of Telekinesis spells ought to help.

    I don't suppose Sleep or Paralyze would work? I guess they'd just stop moving and still block the passageway.

    But if they are susceptible to Magic, then Mass Fear might shift them. Alternatively, Charm might make them friendly and you might be able to shout at them so they'll move.





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Thanks, Peter.
05/26/2015, 04:35:05

    Xanax writes:

    My party is all sorcerers, but I could try finding a scroll of Mass Fear. I'll probably do that, but I suspect it won't work. As noted, I've gotten more than one of them down to very low hit points and they still don't move. I think they're just stuck there no matter which way they go.

    That ramp turns 3 or 4 more times before you get to the bottom, so I'm nowhere close enough to being able to see the chest.

    Bottom line is that I just screwed up. Other than that this is actually a pretty fast and easy game. The rest of Varn didn't take me very long and I know how I would handle the main room where you enter the codes. I don't see the Control Center or Hive being a big problem.





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A further thought
05/26/2015, 07:03:12

    Peter2 writes:

    Would Shrinking Ray reduce them to a size where you could jump over them?




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Aha! Great idea.
05/26/2015, 07:29:01

    Xanax writes:

    I've never used Shrinking Ray. That's just so crazy that it might work. I had worked my nearest beacon to the point that it 'looks' like I could get past them into the corner and I had tried both regular jumping and the jump spell with no success. The ceiling is fairly low there but that might just do the trick.

    I hadn't planned on mastering dark magic and I'd have to do some work to do that. I'm hoping it'll work at one third size; otherwise I'll be off gathering up bones.





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Oh well.
05/26/2015, 10:11:28

    Xanax writes:

    Turns out that Sentinels and Defenders are immune to both Mass Fear and Shrinking Ray. Not sure it would have made a difference anyway - that corner is really buggy. There were four of them. I killed one in hopes of being able to move a little more - no luck. Then two, then three until finally there was just one left. I got him a little ways up into the entrance ramp, then beaconed past him to the corner. At that point if I looked down the next ramp I couldn't even see him - there was absolutely nothing in my way. And I still couldn't move. Had to kill all four of them to get down.

    Got the Varn chest key and the Captains code. Had set a portal in the middle of the radiation room and was just going to do the pools with the codes one at a time. And that is turning out to be weird also. In the past I always remember just walking into each pool and it would ask for the code. Some of them don't seem to work unless you get them just right. I've done two so far and many, many attempts on the others and I just can't get it to work. Maybe it's the fact that there are still lots of Defenders and such in there, but I don't know why that would affect it.

    Varn started so easy - I should have known it would have its revenge on me one way or another.





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That's happened to me, too.
05/26/2015, 16:06:19

    Peter2 writes:

    And that's after I've depopulated the place. Some of the pools, you seem to have to get right into them before they trigger to ask the question; standing in the water at the edge doesn't seem to work.




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I finally got past that and 'finished' the game.
05/26/2015, 17:41:46

    Xanax writes:

    In the pools I finally went to moving just a little bit at a time. I think that maybe all the attacking going on was interfering. 'Finished' in quotation marks because I did have to kill more than I planned to. I'd kind of like to go back and try the Water Temple in Varn to see if that always happens. My (very vague) memory is of going down that ramp and not running into anything till you got to the bottom, but I could be wrong.

    Took me a few reloads to do the hive. Wasn't sure if regular magic worked on the Queen (I should have remembered but I didn't). Tried with blaster and then daggers and neither of those was doing the trick, so finally went to Shrapmetal (at expert level).

    As I noted previously, it's actually a pretty easy and fast game for the most part. Gold was a problem pretty much all the way through and I had to go seek out chests to loot several times - even just to train. My equipment wasn't all that great but it was ok. Finished at level 53.





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One more thing on Shrinking Ray
05/27/2015, 10:27:39

    Xanax writes:

    One place where I had multiple reloads in the Hive was in the tunnel that leads from the main entrance room back towards the reactor area. Sometimes the Devil at the other end will drift off to the side but most often he'll come down the tunnel. When he did that I couldn't get past him, and he did it several times in a row.

    On one of those efforts I tried Shrinking Ray on him. It shrunk him down to a pretty tiny size, but I still couldn't get past him - running up the sides or jumping or any combination. I'm wondering if the game engine actually reduces his 'physical' size in terms of space occupied or just reduces his visible size and damage.

    By the way, I've never used that before, or Mass Fear or Charm. It seems like it might be kind of fun to use those in places and maybe there are some other interesting spells I've never tried.

    Maybe it's an excuse to try another game. I never get tired of playing MM 6. I get the feeling that not many people (even here) are actually playing it any more.





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I have tried Mass Fear and Turn Undead ...
06/03/2015, 08:25:55

    Ramillies writes:

    ... and found them absolutely useless. The main reason is that the monster is clearly labeled with "Fear" (when you right-click on it), but it advances and shoots its ranged attacks against you just as if nothing had happened. The second reason is that they work only on a small subset of monsters, mostly only on some puny monsterlings that you just smash with a weapon because they're not worth of your mana.

    The second reason also applies on other spells like Flesh to Stone (if it's called like that ... ) and Mass Distortion. Of the all worthy foes, these work only on Cuisinarts.





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