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Update on MM6 for Windows 10, and a couple of questions
08/27/2018, 19:49:28

    Ossie writes:

    I don't know about anybody else, but I think I have a problem: I can be sitting idly on my PC not thinking of anything much at all, and then almost involuntarily the thought will pop into my head that I feel like starting another game of MM, and before I know it I'm hours into a game I haven't touched for years, without having had the slightest inkling even 5 minutes before. Just like a comfy pair of shoes you forgot you had.

    As I've now (reluctantly) moved to Windows 10, as previously predicted my old CD copies just didn't work no matter what compatability or resolution settings I tweaked. So I ended up having to buy a Windows 10-compatible copy from GOG (which currently has MM1-9 for $20, if anyone's interested). However, what does not seem to be shown is which version/patch of the game this I this. I'm not yet at the point where any of the obvious differences can be checked (Kriegespire door etc), and things like recovery times are a little too subtle to test, so off the top of your heads, what were some of the general gameplay features which could help identify which version I'm playing? I'm assuming any of the patches won't work, because it's a completely different exe file to the original game, so I would figure that it's the latest patch, but I'm not sure.

    Secondly, a memory-refresher: apart from Mordred and the Obelisk treasure, are there any placed artifacts/relics in MM6, are are they all random drops? Google-fu didn't turn up a list, so I'm assuming fixed artifact locations must have become more common with later MM games?

    Thanks all!





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I have some answers to your question (***Spoiler***), and I'd like to thank you for answers to some questions that I hadn't got round to asking!
08/28/2018, 07:02:06

    Peter2 writes:

    Yes, you will find Excalibur stuck in a rock in Eel-Infested Waters. You can get ALL the artifacts as random drops, but but only provided that you haven't already taken the placed ones. (If you take the placed ones first, you don't find random copies) This means you can legitimately get two versions of Excalibur, Mordred, Igraine, Morgan and Guinevere, which I find extremely useful for my style of parties. The only one of those that I don't have much time for is Excalibur – I find Hades and Poseidon to be the best fighting combination provided that you both have an item "of Regeneration" to counteract Hades' hit point drain, and have taken one of the mods that get rid of the bug that decreases speed when use two weapons.

    The game allows you to find 13 artifacts in total before it stops giving them, so the way to do it is to get your 13 random artifacts before going after any of the placed ones. That way, you can get 18 artifacts for your party.

    I too have had to replace my computer recently, which entailed moving to Win 10, and I didn't know if I could install the games from my old MM6-9 disks, so thank you for that information. I guess GOG is going to get a customer! However, I also want to see if I can transfer some of my old DOS games and run them under Dosbox. I want to see if I have enough digital dexterity left to play Eye of the Beholder and Legend of Darkmoon again.

    I'd be very interested to hear of your experiences with the M&M games though, if you'd care to share them!





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Ahhh yes
08/28/2018, 07:38:59

    Ossie writes:

    Like you, I don't play parties with much use for Excalibur, so I forgot about that. I generally don't have the inclination to multiloot and I like the benefit of having Igraine, Morgan and Guinevere as soon as possible in the game, so I never really end up with two of anything - it was more if there were any others in fixed locations. It seems this was more a fixture of later M&Ms.

    With Windows 10, it does seem somewhat random: I've seen posts here about having simply tweaked compatability settings and getting these games up & running, but no such luck for me. It's the copy protection on the CD versions of games from that era that causes the problem, apparently: it creates a security vulnerability in Windows that was "fixed" with an update in Windows 8, and this update broke these games, but at least you could uninstall the update if you chose to live with the security flaw. With Windows 10, this "fix" is baked into the OS - Windows is completely aware of the issue but made a conscious decision to remove the security flaw even if it broke games. People like us still playing these older games are a diminishing population, unfortunately!

    I can confirm however at worst if you're similarly unlucky with compatability settings that the GOG versions of both Wizardry 8 (after downloading the separate "fix the GOG version of Wizardry 8 for Windows 10" patch) and M&M6 work perfectly. The only thing, like I say, is that you're stuck with whatever patch/version it is, because none of the old patches that we have all had for years will work on the GOG version - it's a completely different exe file. I can also confirm that DOSBox works just as well under Windows 10 - I downloaded Pool of Radiance and played it completely through under DOSBox with no issues.

    I can't speak for the rest of the GOG versions of the M&M series yet (I know you've a soft spot for M&M3 in particular), but no reason to think they wouldn't also work as well. BTW, the GOG version of M&M6 is the one that comes with M&M1-5 - it's essentially the soft copy version of the Millennium Edition that was released - and that is only $10 currently. The $20 is for the M&M6 package plus M&M7, 8 and 9. So if you don't care about 7, 8 or 9 you can get 1-6 for just $10





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*Correction* - security flaw in Windows *7* that was fixed with an update
08/28/2018, 07:42:54

    Ossie writes:





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What I've read ...
08/28/2018, 10:08:03

    Bones writes:

    ... on Celestial heavens is the supposition that GOG used Greyface's patch, so yes, one wouldn't be able to apply and of the original patches, but one wouldn't need to.




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Please could someone tell me, what did Greyface's patch do over and above what Mok's patch did?
08/28/2018, 10:31:20

    Peter2 writes:

    I remember reading about it when Greyface first published it, but in those days I still had a computer that would play the vanilla game, so it was of no more than passing interest.




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Apparentl Grayface has continued to work on it The latest release is July of this year....
08/28/2018, 22:31:42

    Bones writes:

    I'll just link to Grayface's site. All the files and notes are linked from there.


    Related link: Grayface's Site

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It removes most of the bugs I know about, and adds some more goodies.
09/04/2018, 05:33:11

    Ramillies writes:

    So you shouldn't be having the famous problems with various doors that won't open and the keys that will disappear. Also all the recovery bugs are (as far as I know) fixed.

    Some small goodies it adds: a bit of additional info accessible in the game (for instance you can check your recovery times with a right click on your Attack/Shoot bonuses), a quick save, an always run feature, a double speed feature (good for traversing the vast landscape fast), a possibility to play the music from MP3 files in a given folder (instead of the CD playback which often just won't work nowadays) etc. It also makes it possible to switch controls, it can add some more flying controls (like climbing/descending with your mouse wheel — these are really invaluable for people like me who play on laptop keyboards that have the traditional "flying keys" all over the place) and it can even add mouselook.

    (It comes with quite a large configuration file where you can enable, disable and otherwise set all those things up, so you may need to do a bit of reading first.)





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Thank you very much — that's a great help
09/05/2018, 04:17:14

    Peter2 writes:





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You're welcome.
09/05/2018, 18:06:13

    Ramillies writes:





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Glad to have helped.
09/05/2018, 18:08:51

    Ramillies writes:





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Ouch, a double post. Bones, feel free to remove one (along with this one). I had some problems with input rejection.
09/05/2018, 18:09:52

    Ramillies writes:





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Most of those options are not in the GOG version
09/16/2018, 00:57:02

    Ossie writes:

    None of the new gameplay options such as double speed, flip on exit, quicksave etc. But it does fix all the "big" initial bugs like the doors, Gharik's key etc. So seems to be Mok's patch but not Greyface's?




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That does sound like Mok's, then.
09/19/2018, 05:30:37

    Ramillies writes:





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Yes, it would make sense
08/29/2018, 03:23:17

    Ossie writes:

    that GOG released the game with the most updated patch. But as none of the patches were really "official" and were released by the fan community (with the exception of the first one?), I wasn't sure




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Grayface's notes state that his patches work on all versions. I'm not sure what we can infer from that.
08/29/2018, 21:39:26

    Bones writes:





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So this is the first time I've ever seen this, but confirmed........
09/29/2018, 23:44:44

    Ossie writes:

    ........you *CAN* randomly find an artifact if you already have the placed copy! My party already had Mordred and I just looted it from a Gold Dragon. Don't know obviously if this only applies to Mordred, but seems like it shoudl apply to Igraine, Morgan and Guinevere as well.

    I'd be really surprised if I'm the first one to ever experience this





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I've never seen that. I've done a lot of looting. I seem to remember....
09/30/2018, 14:27:07

    Ragwort writes:

    that if you edit yourself an item it may be possible to loot one original. I've never been able to collect a placed item and then loot a copy. I suppose it's possible that Grayface's patch allows it, though there's nothing in the notes about it.




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A simple test for Grayface patch would be hitting F2 in the game.
09/04/2018, 05:35:31

    Ramillies writes:

    If the game starts running at double speed, then the patch is installed. Otherwise it is (probably) not.

    Another simple test would be simply to turn on music. If it plays, then it is installed (Grayface's patch adds MP3 playback from a given folder).





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